Old 08-11-2008, 12:58 AM   #26
chris crook
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Zanesville Ohio
Posts: 246
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ween
You'd probably have to mask the Remarks section too because the photog could always put "Photo by So and So" in there...

Automatic rejection would easily resolve that problem.

As for Knapp's shot, and the wintery CP shot, it looks more like a really lousy, over the top photoshop job than HDR. The compositions are nice though.
__________________
contrarian

Flickr: Armco_block
chris crook is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 01:00 AM   #27
PLEzero
Senior Member
 
PLEzero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Pittsburgh,PA
Posts: 675
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccaranna

Still, as far as the pic, it's OK; I don't normally like overly processed photos. Too fake, kind of like processed cheese. Maybe this phony look is just a fad, kind of like margarine and digital watches.

Also, what's stopping people from creating scenes that didn't really exist but LOOK like they did? That probably already goes on anyway. We (as viewers) pretty much have to trust that the photographer is not pulling a fast one on us no matter what.
Creating a PS fake is a problem on this site. Sometimes, if done properly, if can be very difficult to spot. RP.net has a mission, these kinds of manipulations do not fall in line with that mission. Over the years a few photos have been pointed out as fakes and pulled from the database. All I know is that the planet I live on looks nothing like that and no camera view finder I have ever looked through has make it appear the way it does in Gary's photo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by
Detailed Photo Submission Guidelines

The purpose of our website is to display genuine, authentic photographs of trains and railroad related scenes. Bearing this in mind, digital manipulation of photographs (beyond standard post-processing techniques such as levelling, sharpening, dust removal, etc.) is not permitted on photographs submitted to RailPictures.Net.
__________________
Brad Morocco
Candyland, PA
My Flickr Photos
My RP.net Photos

Last edited by PLEzero; 08-11-2008 at 01:03 AM.
PLEzero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 02:31 AM   #28
Joe the Photog
Senior Member
 
Joe the Photog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 7,892
Default

With two and a half hours left in the day, it's the third most viewed shot behind a hopper car and a shot taken out of the front windshield of a car.



Both good shots, actually.


Joe
__________________
Joe the Photog Dot Com
Joe the Photog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 03:07 AM   #29
Bill
Senior Member
 
Bill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 234
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PLEzero
All I know is that the planet I live on looks nothing like that and no camera view finder I have ever looked through has make it appear the way it does in Gary's photo.
Well said. I agree that the 'photo' does not look realistic at all.
Bill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 03:53 AM   #30
Dump The Air
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 42
Default

Nobody likes a gimmick.
Dump The Air is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 11:35 AM   #31
KevinM
Senior Member
 
KevinM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,982
Default

While I'm not experienced enough to spot the specific techniques that Gary uses to create these shots, my take is that they're much more interesting at night than they are during the day. At night, the shots produce a clarity and a depth that is difficult to achieve with conventional photography methods. Despite the oil-painted look, they are visually stunning at night. During the day, I think this style only works in scenes that just never get the kind of lighting it takes to make a sweet picture.....and having never been to the spot depicted in his latest shot, that may be what Gary is trying to do here.

And in general, whenever I see something here that leaves me scratching my head, I just try to remember one thing: It ain't my site!
__________________
/Kevin

My RP stuff is here.

Link to my Flickr Albums. Lots of Steam Railroad stuff there from all over the US.
KevinM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 05:42 PM   #32
NSditch
Banned
 
NSditch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Frozen barren wilderness, surrrounded by idiots...
Posts: 45
Default

Is Gary's newest daylight work "over processed"? Yes. However, the more important question is...does it work? In my opinion, the answer is also yes.

As for Matthew Hick's image for Morant's, I do not feel it is "over processed". I feel as though any tinkering he did served to emphasize the dramatic conditions in which the image was captured, and which is so indigenous to the region. I believe it is one of the best images to ever make this site.

Some may disagree, as is their right. However, I am more than happy to disagree over images such as these which have such a bold artistic statement, then some of the recently accepted images which serve to promote generic and novice imagery.

Bravo Gary and Matthew. Bravo.
NSditch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 05:47 PM   #33
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,800
Default

I'd still love to see the original, out-of-camera image of Matthew's shot just to see if others could process it to look more "real." As Paul stated earlier, there's nothing on this planet that looks like that.

And Matthew, I'm not picking on you as a photographer, because you're one of my favorite on this site.
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 05:56 PM   #34
NSditch
Banned
 
NSditch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Frozen barren wilderness, surrrounded by idiots...
Posts: 45
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimThias
As Paul stated earlier, there's nothing on this planet that looks like that.
Having ridden the head-end over Morants Curve after a severe thunderstorm, I would beg to differ on that one.
NSditch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 06:04 PM   #35
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,800
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NSditch
Having ridden the head-end over Morants Curve after a severe thunderstorm, I would beg to differ on that one.
I guess you're not seeing the same thing that I and others are seeing. It has nothing to do with being there or the landscape or anything like that.
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 06:13 PM   #36
JRMDC
Senior Member
 
JRMDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,202
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NSditch
Is Gary's newest daylight work "over processed"? Yes. However, the more important question is...does it work? In my opinion, the answer is also yes.

...

Some may disagree, as is their right. However, I am more than happy to disagree over images such as these which have such a bold artistic statement, then some of the recently accepted images which serve to promote generic and novice imagery.

Bravo Gary and Matthew. Bravo.
To extend the discussion, respectfully, what is artistic to you about the Gary shot, what makes it "work." How does stretching reality contribute to what is in this case a standard very wide angle foreground-rocks background-train sort of thing, with what I would call wacko colors?

I can't help but thing of Munch's The Scream or paintings like that. In those cases it works, for me, because it is abstracted from reality. Here, the shot is a reality shot with colors that detract from that dimension without adding anything of value.
__________________
My RP pix are here.
My Flickr pix are here.

My commentaries on rail pictures are in my blog.

RP Photo Albums:
Cabooses
Engine Details
Farm and Train
Plumes!
Railroad Details
Signal Details
Switchstand Shots
JRMDC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 06:21 PM   #37
F40PH271
Senior Member
 
F40PH271's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 104
Default

Although the photo was added more than three and a half years ago, I ran across this one today. I don't know what motivated me to search for the most popular photos taken in Seattle, but this was one of them:

Image © James Guffey
PhotoID: 85972
Photograph © James Guffey
F40PH271 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 06:50 PM   #38
PLEzero
Senior Member
 
PLEzero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Pittsburgh,PA
Posts: 675
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NSditch
Having ridden the head-end over Morants Curve after a severe thunderstorm, I would beg to differ on that one.

That is a completely absurd statement. Human eyes just do not see color like that! Sure, it might be nice art but RP.net is not about that kind of art. It is about representing a natural scene. Not something created in the computer after the fact.
__________________
Brad Morocco
Candyland, PA
My Flickr Photos
My RP.net Photos
PLEzero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 06:54 PM   #39
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,800
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis A. Livesey
This image is arresting and it compels you to look at it.

Image © Gary Knapp
PhotoID: 246101
Photograph © Gary Knapp


It is however, unreal looking suggesting to me that it is heavily processed. I'm therefore surprised it was accepted.

If this is a new era here, that's fine since I have shots that have been rejected that I could re-submit if this is so.

Mind you, just like everyone else here, I'm a big fan of Gary's work. I applaud his ideas and admire his tenacity to get those images.

Have RP's standards changed? Or was it accepted just because of who shot it?

Well, Gary speaks:

Quote:
The scene is depicted accurately as I saw it, no polarizer, a lot of Mother Nature!

I guess that settles it.
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 06:59 PM   #40
PLEzero
Senior Member
 
PLEzero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Pittsburgh,PA
Posts: 675
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimThias
I guess that settles it.
Except for that whole part you managed to leave out after that statement:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Knapp
! I use the same NIK software filtering here as in night photos.

I can say a lot of things, that does not make them true. I still can't believe people actually think somewhere on this planet the world randomly looks like that. Magical glowing skies and cartoon like beaches and grass. Wake up, people!
__________________
Brad Morocco
Candyland, PA
My Flickr Photos
My RP.net Photos
PLEzero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 07:01 PM   #41
River Rails Photography
Banned
 
River Rails Photography's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 404
Send a message via AIM to River Rails Photography
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimThias
Well, Gary speaks:




I guess that settles it.


Then this raises it.


Quote:
I use the same NIK software filtering here as in night photos. Glad you enjoy the view as much as I did!

And his night photos are often overproccesed.
River Rails Photography is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 07:03 PM   #42
Ween
Senior Member
 
Ween's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,861
Default

Quote:
I still can't believe people actually think somewhere on this planet the world randomly looks like that. Magical glowing skies and cartoon like beaches and grass. Wake up, people!
Umm, hello? 'Shrooms. I heard the Canon 5D has a filter that can replicate the effects of a 'Psychedelic Trip.' Duh...
__________________
Ween is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 07:10 PM   #43
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,800
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ween
Umm, hello? 'Shrooms. I heard the Canon 5D has a filter that can replicate the effects of a 'Psychedelic Trip.' Duh...
Hmmm...

< grabs 5D... >

Back in a bit...
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 07:13 PM   #44
Ween
Senior Member
 
Ween's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,861
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimThias
Hmmm...

< grabs 5D... >

Back in a bit...
Look in the Menu...it's right next to the "Make Stuff Look Fake" setting. No, wait, it's a sub-folder in that setting...
__________________
Ween is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 07:22 PM   #45
F40PH271
Senior Member
 
F40PH271's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 104
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by River Rails Photography
And his night photos are often overproccesed.
Yes. Because that isn't what this thread has been about the whole time. It's been discussed here before and it will be again. Thank you for your input.
F40PH271 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 07:37 PM   #46
trainboysd40
Senior Member
 
trainboysd40's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Calgary, Alberta on the CP Laggan Subdivision
Posts: 2,048
Send a message via MSN to trainboysd40
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NSditch
Is Gary's newest daylight work "over processed"? Yes. However, the more important question is...does it work? In my opinion, the answer is also yes.

As for Matthew Hick's image for Morant's, I do not feel it is "over processed". I feel as though any tinkering he did served to emphasize the dramatic conditions in which the image was captured, and which is so indigenous to the region. I believe it is one of the best images to ever make this site.

Some may disagree, as is their right. However, I am more than happy to disagree over images such as these which have such a bold artistic statement, then some of the recently accepted images which serve to promote generic and novice imagery.

Bravo Gary and Matthew. Bravo.
You're funny, really funny. Not overprocessed? Even I think so!
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimThias
I'd still love to see the original, out-of-camera image of Matthew's shot just to see if others could process it to look more "real." As Paul stated earlier, there's nothing on this planet that looks like that.

And Matthew, I'm not picking on you as a photographer, because you're one of my favorite on this site.
Thanks for the compliment.
Now, if you REALLY want to see the original...
Here.
It's not hard to see why I submitted the processed version, is it?
__________________
got a D5 IIi and now he doesnt afread fo 12800 iSO
Youtube (Model Railway, Vlogs, Tutorials, and prototype)
My Website
Obligatory link to shots on RP, HERE
trainboysd40 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2008, 07:45 PM   #47
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,800
Default

Matthew, I'd do some selective lightening with the original and resubmit. It definitely looks more natural. And even though I've never been to Morant's Curve, I'm gonna take a walk on the wildside and say that the original looks more like reality, contrary to what "NSDitch" has implied.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PLEzero
Except for that whole part you managed to leave out after that statement:
Of course, that was intentional, Brad. You DO know I agree with you 100%, right?

Last edited by JimThias; 08-11-2008 at 07:48 PM.
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2008, 01:14 PM   #48
Wizzo
Senior Member
 
Wizzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 545
Default

Quote:
The scene is depicted accurately as I saw it, no polarizer, a lot of Mother Nature!
Unquote


As an example of photo art I like it and am curious as to the exact techniques used in post processing.

As to whether it should be on RP - ask the screeners

But.............and please don't take this as an insult Gary because I always make a point of looking at your photos (the night shots are so unlike anything possible in Europe)...........if you see the shot in question as being representative of the actual scene as the camera and your eyes saw it.........please seek out a good optician
__________________
STEVE

Press here to see my pics on railpictures.net

More pics here D1059 on Flickr
Wizzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2008, 03:04 PM   #49
NSditch
Banned
 
NSditch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Frozen barren wilderness, surrrounded by idiots...
Posts: 45
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMDC
To extend the discussion, respectfully, what is artistic to you about the Gary shot, what makes it "work." How does stretching reality contribute to what is in this case a standard very wide angle foreground-rocks background-train sort of thing, with what I would call wacko colors?

I can't help but thing of Munch's The Scream or paintings like that. In those cases it works, for me, because it is abstracted from reality. Here, the shot is a reality shot with colors that detract from that dimension without adding anything of value.
Simply stated, perspective is reality. And when I look at that image, it is in line with what generally seems to be Gary's perspective based on his other works.

If you don't like the style...don't shoot or process like that. Simple enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trainboysd40
You're funny, really funny. Not overprocessed? Even I think so!
Glad I made you laugh. But you obviously didn't take it as far you could have. That could have gotten really ugly really quick with overkill saturation and contrast adjustments. But it looks good to me. Just my honest opinion.

Of course...you know what they say about opinions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by PLEzero
That is a completely absurd statement. Human eyes just do not see color like that! Sure, it might be nice art but RP.net is not about that kind of art. It is about representing a natural scene. Not something created in the computer after the fact.
Art is art, and art is subjective. So to each his own. However, I guess RP.net is also about washed out 3/4 nose shots judging by some of the accepted images as of late.

I'd rather see Gary's art here, than a plethora of novice wedgies.

Last edited by NSditch; 08-12-2008 at 03:09 PM.
NSditch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2008, 03:19 PM   #50
Darryl Rule
Senior Member
 
Darryl Rule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 260
Default

Well could you provide us with some of your work so we can see what kind of shots should be posted on this site? Your only link is to the NS website, so that doesn't really show your personal work.
__________________
View my Railpictures Photos
Darryl Rule is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:40 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.