Old 08-22-2006, 06:49 PM   #1
photogeek88
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Default Bad Cropping/Angle Rejection

Well, this has to be one of the first times I've gotten a bad cropping and angle rejection on a simple shot like this one, and I'm terribly confused. Suggestions?

Last edited by photogeek88; 08-22-2006 at 06:52 PM.
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Old 08-22-2006, 06:59 PM   #2
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Wesley,

These type of shots have been getting the axe as of late (i.e. shots of the power and a few of the cars). Not really sure why, but even though it's UP, it's a nice shot...
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Old 08-22-2006, 07:23 PM   #3
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I Like That Photo Its A Good Photo If I Was You I Would Submit It Back To Them Thats A Good Photo
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Old 08-22-2006, 07:35 PM   #4
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I believe that is what is now commonly refered to as a "Telemash" shot, where the image is so compressed together because of the newer digital telephoto processes. I can see "their" point about rejection.
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Old 08-22-2006, 08:19 PM   #5
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Quote:
Well, this has to be one of the first times I've gotten a bad cropping and angle rejection on a simple shot like this one, and I'm terribly confused.
It looks a little tight to me on the right side and a bit soft as well. That said, if I were you, I'd let it slide. The shot itself breaks down to the fact that it's pretty much nothing more than a bland shot of some common power.
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Old 08-22-2006, 10:24 PM   #6
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eh not a bad shot, but nothing fantastic. I do like the lighting. I would have left a lil more room on the right. I ono seems like it should have been accepted to me, but then again it is just common power. I would not really put much effort in, but do what ever you want to.

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Old 08-22-2006, 11:14 PM   #7
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Honestly, IMO the "bad cropping" may be because of the extra space on top. There is far more open space there then the right and lower sides. I don't know about the angle as I happen to like telephoto shots like that, but maybe it would be worth recropping and another try. Good Luck

Brian
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Old 08-22-2006, 11:56 PM   #8
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Red face Pluses and minuses

Pluses: the image has beautiful lighting, that kind of tight composition can be really interesting, and technically the picture looks good to me. Maybe could be sharpened a bit, but I see too many oversharpened images here including my own. Probably the sharpness is okay.

Minuses: The composition is a bit too tight at the top. The big minus is this kind of image is a dime a dozen. Which doesn't mean it is a bad picture, just that folks have seen something similar too many times so it is easy to hit the reject button over minor or debatable issues. I like tele-mash shots myself, and use the tele lens way too often. Sometimes it's good to force yourself to go wide angle just for variety.

OOPS....POST EDIT. Just realized I was hiding the top part of your image under my tool bar! Idiot me. Anyway, ignore the above comment about the too tight cropping at the top. I probably would now agree with Brian that an even tighter cropping at the top would improve it. But not too much. Keep the nose within the rule of thirds. I like the picture, but my guess is the major problem is the screeners see too many tele-mash shots.

John West

Last edited by John West; 08-23-2006 at 12:04 AM.
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Old 08-23-2006, 12:22 AM   #9
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Thanks everyone for commenting. I've really been trying to watch the rule-of-thirds ever since that one thread, and I wanted to have the cab on the right third line, but not have it dead center on that line so I put a little extra sky in to help put it more to the bottom of that right third line. I'll give it a try with the tighter cropping of sky, and see what they have to say. I didn't wake up at 6 on the last day of Summer Break for nothin!
As for rejection of 'telemash' shots, I tried another version of the same shot, showing more cars. That got shot down too. What do you all think?
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Old 08-23-2006, 12:42 AM   #10
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The second one is my favorite. It just needs some taken off the top, and perhaps a tad added to the right. Also, try adjusting the levels a bit. Nice shot.
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Old 08-23-2006, 12:44 AM   #11
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Cool Rule One....

....avoid scenes with power poles in the background. Took me a long time to learn that. I can remove them with PS, but that is verbotten here.

The second shot could be interesting but there is just too much clutter. Your original tight crop was the right way to go given the power lines and stuff. If it weren't for the power lines and some cars behind the signal mast, it would have been interesting to compose an image with the signal mast along the left edge sort of framing the train.

But anyone who gets up before the sun comes up will eventually get a gangbusters shot!.

I would go with a revision of the original shot and see what happens.

John West

Last edited by John West; 08-23-2006 at 12:46 AM.
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Old 08-23-2006, 01:23 AM   #12
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I agree actually I like the first one better, but the second has plenty of interest as well. Here are two cropping options, in my opinion, for the shots.

Pick the one you like best, revise it and give it a try again. I have plenty of shots I love that haven't made the cut here so even if neither make it, you certainly didn't waste getting up at 6am if you like what you got.

Brian
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Old 08-23-2006, 01:28 AM   #13
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Wink Good crops

I like Brian's crops. The second illustrates my frustration with the power poles. There is a lot of interesting stuff in the foreground. And the lighting is gangbusters. But the power poles really detract. I wonder how it would look with a little Photoshopping of the power poles, not that I'd ever do anything like that.

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Old 08-23-2006, 01:55 AM   #14
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The 2nd shot stands the better chance of being accepted. As it is, though, the subject is pretty tight on the right side of the frame. If it had a bit more room to "breathe" it would most likely be acceptable.
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Old 08-23-2006, 03:00 AM   #15
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Talking What I meant to say.....

....is Rule One is when the boss speaks listen. Rule Two is about power poles.

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Old 08-23-2006, 04:12 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John West
....avoid scenes with power poles in the background. Took me a long time to learn that. I can remove them with PS, but that is verbotten here.
I beg to differ Mr. West...
Image © Mike W.
PhotoID: 155327
Photograph © Mike W.

Ok, so it's not the best photo but I like it.
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Old 08-23-2006, 04:32 AM   #17
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Talking Foreground!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slopes09
I beg to differ Mr. West...
Image © Mike W.
PhotoID: 155327
Photograph © Mike W.

Ok, so it's not the best photo but I like it.
I said BACKGROUND. And that is a communications pole, not a power pole.

Nice picture. When I first saw it I considered nominating it for a PCA. With the rapid disappearance of the communication pole lines along railroads it is kind of nice to work traditional pole lines like that into the picture, just like Mike did. I have tried to do so, but not as successfully as he did.

On the C&TS they are actually rebuilding communication ("telegraph") lines that were torn down after the DRGW abandoned.

Communications lines are interesting. Power lines are ugly.

John
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Old 08-23-2006, 04:41 PM   #18
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One thing that makes the original an awkward photo, is that the nose width is nearly as wide as the legnth of the locomotive.
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Old 08-23-2006, 05:40 PM   #19
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I'm chiming in a bit late here, but my first reaction to the first shot was, not enough room in front of the engine. I see that Chris Starnes agrees. If you have the space in the original shot, recrop with some leading space. Great light though.

True tele-mash shots are more head on and since the train is really coming at you in a classic mash, there isn't the need for leading space in front of the engine. This is more of a 3/4 shot, so a tight crop doesn't work here.

On your second shot, the power poles are mega ugly but the signals are cool. Is there any way to move around a bit more broadside the next time you go out, so you can get one of the signals into the shot but get that power pole out of the left side of the frame?

I agree with John, code lines are great, either in the foreground or background, as long as they are framed properly. Power poles, especially high tension ones, are generally ugly and not necessarily part of the railroad scene. There are exceptions, but I don't think this is one of them.

Again, nice light!

Michael Allen
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Old 08-24-2006, 02:10 AM   #20
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Thanks again for the tips all! Well, I can always sue the electric company for emotional distress, but aside from that, there's not much chance of trying to get those high-tension poles out of the shot, unless I go vertical, which may work. I could also try a little closer to the ROW, or a bit farther down the tracks from the signal, but that may be leading me astray onto Union Pacific property. And remember, we gotta keep it legal, keep it safe...

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Old 08-24-2006, 04:31 AM   #21
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Congrats!

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Old 08-24-2006, 04:58 AM   #22
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Talking Forget....

...what I said about Rule One. Congratulations.

John
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Old 08-25-2006, 06:30 AM   #23
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good job =)
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