Old 06-15-2007, 08:32 PM   #1
Serrator
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 57
Default My Rejection

Hey guys,

Since I didn't make the cut I thought I would post this here for anyone interested. It is located in Jackson Missouri and is a tourist dinner ride gig.



...and they definately wouldn't like this:

Serrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2007, 08:45 PM   #2
Mike B.
Banned
 
Mike B.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,343
Default

If you leveled it you might have a shot at getting it in.
Mike B. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2007, 09:10 PM   #3
JRMDC
Senior Member
 
JRMDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,202
Default

If you are interested, you can put the URL of the rejection into a post and we can take a look at the reasons for rejection and offer advice.

Nice PS work.
__________________
My RP pix are here.
My Flickr pix are here.

My commentaries on rail pictures are in my blog.

RP Photo Albums:
Cabooses
Engine Details
Farm and Train
Plumes!
Railroad Details
Signal Details
Switchstand Shots
JRMDC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2007, 09:21 PM   #4
Serrator
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 57
Default

Thanks Mike.

Well I checked the pics that are currently on RP to see if they had this engine and there are two. One of which is the same shot but from the other side, which has a ton of distractions all around it. You mention "leveling" it, well I am not sure what is meant by that. There is no straight horizon line to reference, so I can't go by that. I also checked the vertical run of the handrail on my shot compared to the existing one that is on RP in Photoshop and mine is closer to vertical than that one. I do see a pole or tower in the background that appears to be leaning...and it might just be leaning I do not really know on that. Anyway I am happy with just posting it here for the few to see.

I also have some additional pics from within the engine and some others if you guys care to look, here is one (this is a three picture stitch):


Here are the rest:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/serrato...7600280623914/
Serrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2007, 10:02 PM   #5
JRMDC
Senior Member
 
JRMDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,202
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
Anyway I am happy with just posting it here for the few to see.
Suit yourself! Nice stitch work.
__________________
My RP pix are here.
My Flickr pix are here.

My commentaries on rail pictures are in my blog.

RP Photo Albums:
Cabooses
Engine Details
Farm and Train
Plumes!
Railroad Details
Signal Details
Switchstand Shots
JRMDC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2007, 10:50 PM   #6
Serrator
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 57
Default

JRMDC,

Sorry didn't see your post till after I posted mine to Mike.

The rejection was "not leveled" and that was it. Oh well.

btw I checked out your rail pics... you have some neat captures!
Serrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2007, 10:56 PM   #7
JimThias
Senior Member
 
JimThias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 9,800
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
Hey guys,

Since I didn't make the cut I thought I would post this here for anyone interested. It is located in Jackson Missouri and is a tourist dinner ride gig.
Is the first one an HDR image? The color and lighting of the trucks kind of "feels" like it.


Quote:
...and they definately wouldn't like this:
I've seen quite a few "out of frame" photoshop jobs over the years, but this one is pretty creative. Nice work!
JimThias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2007, 11:27 PM   #8
Serrator
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 57
Default

Jim,

Yes the first shot was done using 3 bracketed shots, -2 0 +2. There was some high contrast with the glaring sun as well as to try and bring out some of the shadow area details.

Also if you notice the inside cab shot was done the same way, if not there is no way I could have shown the inside of the cab and the outside without one being blown out or the other too dark. This shot is comprised of nine shots total to achieve that, I was in a rush that day or I would have panned around and got more of the cab.

Thanks on the PS OOB comment, I have fun with it. If you want here is a whole bunch more I have done:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/serrato...7594091393842/
Serrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2007, 11:51 PM   #9
Warren
Senior Member
 
Warren's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: St. Charles, Missouri
Posts: 287
Send a message via MSN to Warren
Default

Looks to be leaning to the right by the pole on the left. It is cropped so tight it will be hard to fix as is.

And yes your OOB's are nice!
__________________
Click Here to view my photos at RailPictures.Net!
Click Here to view my videos at rail-videos.net
My webshots photos

Last edited by Warren; 06-15-2007 at 11:55 PM.
Warren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2007, 11:58 PM   #10
JRMDC
Senior Member
 
JRMDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,202
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
JRMDC,

Sorry didn't see your post till after I posted mine to Mike.

The rejection was "not leveled" and that was it. Oh well.

btw I checked out your rail pics... you have some neat captures!
Thanks.

BTW, what is this "oh well"? If it isn't level, then level it and resubmit! I just popped it into software, it looks like it needs 2 degrees counter-clockwise. Maybe 1.5. If there are no horizontals, look at the verticals. In fact, I believe in looking at verticals first, they are less likely to be problematic because horizontals aren't necessarily horizontal if the line is receding from or approaching the camera. Here, I look at the vertical at the back of the power - handrails can be a problem also as they are not necessarily vertical. And the post in the background, who knows how much that thing is tilting.
__________________
My RP pix are here.
My Flickr pix are here.

My commentaries on rail pictures are in my blog.

RP Photo Albums:
Cabooses
Engine Details
Farm and Train
Plumes!
Railroad Details
Signal Details
Switchstand Shots
JRMDC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2007, 12:00 AM   #11
JRMDC
Senior Member
 
JRMDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,202
Default

This is 1.5 degrees.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 519337432_d23303f324_c.jpg (144.8 KB, 269 views)
__________________
My RP pix are here.
My Flickr pix are here.

My commentaries on rail pictures are in my blog.

RP Photo Albums:
Cabooses
Engine Details
Farm and Train
Plumes!
Railroad Details
Signal Details
Switchstand Shots
JRMDC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2007, 12:21 AM   #12
Serrator
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 57
Default

-Warren...thanks for checking them out.

-JRMDC...what exactly are your referencing to adjust the angle? The "power"?
To my eye I really don't see any appreciable difference in your adjustment and the original. Realize though I am not a train expert by any means and take my input as a grain of salt.
Serrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2007, 02:43 AM   #13
JRMDC
Senior Member
 
JRMDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,202
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
-JRMDC...what exactly are your referencing to adjust the angle? The "power"?
To my eye I really don't see any appreciable difference in your adjustment and the original. Realize though I am not a train expert by any means and take my input as a grain of salt.
It's not a matter of train expertise, it's a photography thing. I am looking at lines that I think should be vertical - in this case, I am looking a lot at the vertical line defining the back of the engine, and also the vertical lines in the cars behind. With a round nose like that, there isn't much to work with up front. I think the handrails going up to the cab aren't necessarily vertical. Unless the engine is leaning into a curve, generally something should be straight up and down. It's not an easy image to work with in terms of getting it level, but I think I have it about right.

A degree and a half is a big difference; I routinely adjust by a degree (I shoot mostly handheld) and not infrequently by a half degree. So 1.5 matters.
__________________
My RP pix are here.
My Flickr pix are here.

My commentaries on rail pictures are in my blog.

RP Photo Albums:
Cabooses
Engine Details
Farm and Train
Plumes!
Railroad Details
Signal Details
Switchstand Shots
JRMDC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2007, 08:35 AM   #14
Serrator
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 57
Default

JRMDC,

Thanks for taking the time to adjust the image and explaining your reference point. When I was at work scrolling between your adjusted image and my original I honestly did not see any real improvement, gain or value added to the shot. I think the pole and it's lean in either image is still there and may draw unwanted attention. But I have a biased opinion of course so I thought I would put your image to the test. On my way home tonight I stopped in at my brothers house and he has a dual monitor setup that are side by side and it got me thinking. I put your adjusted image on one monitor and my original on the other and asked my brother and several others that were there to tell me what if any differences they saw. They all thought I had cloned something out or some other sneaky PS trick since I have been known to do that. So I told them that I had not done any of those type things but it was something other than basic color, levels and the like. Nobody ever mentioned levelness or any other difference, even after I told them they had to really look hard to even notice the adjustment and that was side by side. My **small** point to this is that sometimes we may get caught up in such nuances in imagery that we may miss the bigger overall benefit of some nice pictures. How many nice train pics get dismissed by a 1 degree tilt that perhaps the majority of folks don't see or care about? You can pick any image on this site and there will be some nuance that will not be up to snuff by one or more persons I bet...but does that supposed minuscule imperfection ruin or contaminate an otherwise nice photo? As another data point, I have had this train image on my Flickr gallery for about 3 weeks I believe and so far of the 200+ visits not one mentioned levelness and it belongs to several train groups there. I have also posted this in another photo forum and one gentleman out of 200+ said that he thought it was un-level, but he is also the same guy that recommended this place for me to post my image, so I am predicting he had been bitten by the levelness issue as well at some time and could be hypersensitive to that. I am not dismissing that there is a 1.5 degree tilt in my simple image, that can be proven in PS or argued against possibly, but does it really matter in this case? Heck, I bet I could even open your adjusted image and find that it is still titled to some fractional degree.

I also have to humbly disagree with your statement that, "it's not a matter about train expertise, it's a photography thing", but in the very next sentences you start describing parts of the train that are vertical and that the "handrails are not necessarily vertical" and so on. I thought the handrails should be vertical which shows my lack of train savvy and from your good info shows at least some train "expertise" was put to use along with good photography and perhaps even better post processing.

Like I said I am content to just have the picture posted here for folks to view and not worry about 1.5 degrees and or making the screeners grade. I could have easily adjusted this in PS several different ways had I cared about this nuance as well as adding a new puffy cloud scene and cloning out any of several objects, but I let it ride as is. All I was hoping was that the picture would bring some interest to any who desire to see trains and not worry about trying to please some screener. There may be a rule spelled out on this site that no picture with a 1.5 degree tilt on a known vertical will be allowed, if so please accept my apologies for my ramblings and please link me to it.

I live less than 3 miles from this train so perhaps the next opportunity I get I will make sure to bring my laser leveling GPS guidance system before snapping away and posting my pics.

Hey it's all good fun and interesting to see others viewpoints on these matters and gain new insights possibly.

btw...is there a page with who the screeners are and their credentials with regards to photography? I saw one page that lists them but no further data on their backgrounds.

Hey on a totally different subject check out this image and story I did this week if you are interested in rare and unique treasures...(please don't mention that the right side of the image is tilted!! ), here is the link:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/serrator/545152720/

Last edited by Serrator; 06-16-2007 at 08:40 AM.
Serrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2007, 10:21 AM   #15
JRMDC
Senior Member
 
JRMDC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,202
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
Nobody ever mentioned levelness or any other difference, even after I told them they had to really look hard to even notice the adjustment and that was side by side. My **small** point to this is that sometimes we may get caught up in such nuances in imagery that we may miss the bigger overall benefit of some nice pictures. ... I am not dismissing that there is a 1.5 degree tilt in my simple image, that can be proven in PS or argued against possibly, but does it really matter in this case? Heck, I bet I could even open your adjusted image and find that it is still titled to some fractional degree.
I don't disagree. In this case, given there are no strong horizontal lines or vertical lines - the pole is in the background and seems off somehow, what is that segment on the top? - it doesn't make a big difference to the feel of the picture. But a couple of things. First, to someone who is more into the details, it is noticeable. More so because of the pole, for sure. Second, the screener noticed it, and if you change it by 1.5 degrees, an easy thing to do, it gets in. This particular forum is about considering what needs to happen to an image for it to be accepted; not totally so, but that is the leading category being discussed here. So I respond to your shot in that context.

It's funny you mention it, because there has been some discussion in the forum recently about accepted shots that were or appeared to be non-level. There are certainly cases of shots being accepted that (at least to some eyes) appear much more "off" than yours.

Quote:
I also have to humbly disagree with your statement that, "it's not a matter about train expertise, it's a photography thing", but in the very next sentences you start describing parts of the train that are vertical and that the "handrails are not necessarily vertical" and so on. I thought the handrails should be vertical which shows my lack of train savvy and from your good info shows at least some train "expertise" was put to use along with good photography and perhaps even better post processing.
Sorry, disagree. As a photographer taking any sort of a shot, I look to make sure the picture is level. Honestly, I have no idea if the handrails are or should be truly vertical, but given that I made all sorts of other stuff vertical and the handrails did not turn out to be so, I concluded that they must be a bit off for some reason - in fact I have no idea why they might be. So I guess I cheated, or used reverse logic, or something. Maybe I should have made that clear.

Quote:
I could have easily adjusted this in PS several different ways had I cared about this nuance as well as adding a new puffy cloud scene and cloning out any of several objects, but I let it ride as is.
Adding and cloning are not allowed for shots submitted to RP.

Quote:
All I was hoping was that the picture would bring some interest to any who desire to see trains and not worry about trying to please some screener.
By definition, if you are submitting to RP, you are concerned, or at least confronted with, the opinion of a screener!

Quote:
Hey it's all good fun and interesting to see others viewpoints on these matters and gain new insights possibly.
It sure is. You will find, however, that RP is a site for those who are not quite so casual about this as you are. It is a site for those who want to make and look at high quality images. Sometimes, perhaps in your case, perhaps not, there is too much focus on technical details that may or may not have much impact. But generally speaking, that is not true, and I think you may be getting an incorrect impression of the site.

BTW, I have no connection to the site or the forum other than I enjoy participating.
__________________
My RP pix are here.
My Flickr pix are here.

My commentaries on rail pictures are in my blog.

RP Photo Albums:
Cabooses
Engine Details
Farm and Train
Plumes!
Railroad Details
Signal Details
Switchstand Shots

Last edited by JRMDC; 06-16-2007 at 11:54 AM.
JRMDC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2007, 07:48 PM   #16
Ween
Senior Member
 
Ween's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,861
Default

Serrator,

Instead of spinning your wheels over this by showing your friends side-by-side comparisons, writing multi-paragraph posts about how 1.5 degrees doesn't really matter in the big scheme of things, wondering about the credentials of the screeners, and on and on and on...

...how about you accept the fact that this site has has a set of standards it uses to screen photos and if you disagree, you find someplace else to display your work?

I don't mean to sound harsh, but you're certainly not the first person to take issue with the standards that are used here, and no amount of "proof" that you are right and they are wrong is going to change anything.

You either accept it and adapt, or move on.

Look how much time you have spent justifying "your way" when it would have taken maybe 30 seconds to go Rotate Canvas->Arbitrary->CCW 1.5 and this shot would be in the database...
__________________
Ween is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2007, 10:53 PM   #17
Serrator
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 57
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMDC
the pole is in the background and seems off somehow, what is that segment on the top?
I am not sure what that is, I think it is some kinda of scabbed on antenna. Next time I go by that way I am going to check it out.

Quote:
It's funny you mention it, because there has been some discussion in the forum recently about accepted shots that were or appeared to be non-level. There are certainly cases of shots being accepted that (at least to some eyes) appear much more "off" than yours.
I agree, there are accepted shots that seem to display much more non-level attributes, but it can be somewhat subjective and what one likes others won't.



Quote:
Sorry, disagree. As a photographer taking any sort of a shot, I look to make sure the picture is level. Honestly, I have no idea if the handrails are or should be truly vertical, but given that I made all sorts of other stuff vertical and the handrails did not turn out to be so, I concluded that they must be a bit off for some reason - in fact I have no idea why they might be. So I guess I cheated, or used reverse logic, or something. Maybe I should have made that clear.
I can't say I always try to shoot level, they are some shots that I use for different reasons, artistic stuff and things, but in the context of shooting trains I would say that would be a good idea. But on this point we can agree to disagree.



Quote:
Adding and cloning are not allowed for shots submitted to RP.
Can you please link me to these rules, I for the life of me can't seem to find them. I did a search on the forums with no luck and searched the main page for submission guidelines to no avail.


Quote:
BTW, I have no connection to the site or the forum other than I enjoy participating.
Ha...you are really an undercover screener!

Enjoyed our little discussion and as I have mentioned I am content to just post my image here and not worry about making the cut. Heck more folks may look here at my image than ever would in the main gallery!
Serrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2007, 11:05 PM   #18
Ween
Senior Member
 
Ween's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,861
Default

Quote:
Can you please link me to these rules, I for the life of me can't seem to find them. I did a search on the forums with no luck and searched the main page for submission guidelines to no avail.
http://www.railpictures.net/addphotos/

Click on Detailed Photo Submission Guidelines:

http://www.railpictures.net/addphotos/guidelines.php
__________________
Ween is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2007, 11:30 PM   #19
Serrator
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 57
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ween
Serrator,

Instead of spinning your wheels over this by showing your friends side-by-side comparisons, writing multi-paragraph posts about how 1.5 degrees doesn't really matter in the big scheme of things, wondering about the credentials of the screeners, and on and on and on...
Well...I thought I was in a forum where ideas, concepts and opinions were to be discussed. I could be mistaken though.

Quote:
...how about you accept the fact that this site has has a set of standards it uses to screen photos
Can you please link me to the standards? I did a search with no success.
*Update... I see you posted me a link...thanks.


Quote:
and if you disagree, you find someplace else to display your work?
I thought I did?? I posted my work here as an alternative to the screened gallery.

Quote:
I don't mean to sound harsh,
You do sound "harsh" and there really is no need for it. I was enjoying my conversation with JRMDC expressing our viewpoints and rationals.

Quote:
but you're certainly not the first person to take issue with the standards that are used here, and no amount of "proof" that you are right and they are wrong is going to change anything.
Not sure I have ever taken issue with the "standards" since I don't even necessarily know what they might be?? Although I think I have a hint of what un-level means here now.

Quote:
You either accept it and adapt, or move on.
I thought it was clear in several of my posts that I accepted my fate and adapted? I adapted by presenting my image here for others to see. I never brought up the reason for my rejection, others asked for it. I would have never even mentioned it but since others asked they got my input. Simple as that. Hopefully some other photographer may read *some* of these posts and garner better insight to what makes the screeners un-rejectful.

Quote:
Look how much time you have spent justifying "your way" when it would have taken maybe 30 seconds to go Rotate Canvas->Arbitrary->CCW 1.5 and this shot would be in the database...
I enjoy a lively informative discussion and whether I choose to adjust one of my photos to satisfy some unknown persons judgment is my choice.

How are you so sure that rotating my image 1.5 would make the cut? I think not now.
Serrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2007, 12:05 AM   #20
Ween
Senior Member
 
Ween's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,861
Default

Quote:
How are you so sure that rotating my image 1.5 would make the cut? I think not now.
Because it's manipulated?
__________________
Ween is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2007, 02:45 AM   #21
John Ryan
Senior Member
 
John Ryan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
Posts: 497
Send a message via AIM to John Ryan
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRMDC
It's not a matter of train expertise, it's a photography thing. I am looking at lines that I think should be vertical - in this case, I am looking a lot at the vertical line defining the back of the engine, and also the vertical lines in the cars behind. With a round nose like that, there isn't much to work with up front. I think the handrails going up to the cab aren't necessarily vertical. Unless the engine is leaning into a curve, generally something should be straight up and down. It's not an easy image to work with in terms of getting it level, but I think I have it about right.
Exactly.

All the experts can look at this image until their eyes become crossed like a siamese cat. If you look at the handrails in the middle of the carbody, they're vertical. If you look at the caboose on the extreme left, it's vertical. Other parts of the train aren't. Convergence? Perspective? Computerized diddling? Who knows? The bottom line is that it looks fine taken as a whole.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
Well...I thought I was in a forum where ideas, concepts and opinions were to be discussed. I could be mistaken though.
Mwahahaha! Welcome to the forum.
John Ryan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2007, 02:49 AM   #22
Cyclonetrain
Senior Member
 
Cyclonetrain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Downers Grove, IL
Posts: 359
Send a message via AIM to Cyclonetrain Send a message via Yahoo to Cyclonetrain
Default

As long as we're nitpicking, I have a few things to add.

The sky is way too dark. It looks unnatural and way too blue. It makes it look like you used an array of external flashes to light up the engine, while not properly setting the exposure to allow natural light behind the locomotive.

The angle is pretty boring and way overused for railroad photography. A more interesting angle would be lower to the ground, closer to the engine and more in line with the engine itself, taken with a wider lens.

And as long as we're into manipulation, you can always add contrast and desaturate it to give it that sepia/faded color slide look
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 519337432_d23303f324_b.jpg (407.0 KB, 201 views)
Cyclonetrain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2007, 06:25 AM   #23
Mike B.
Banned
 
Mike B.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,343
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
I am not dismissing that there is a 1.5 degree tilt in my simple image, that can be proven in PS or argued against possibly, but does it really matter in this case?
Yes, it does. It's not hard to tell when looking at your photo that it's unlevel. You only need to look at the engine to tell it's leaning. 1.5 degrees is A LOT. Fact is, leveling a photo is a very easy thing to do and when a photo is known to be unlevel, it should be leveled. If you don't want to level the photo, fine, I really don't care if it's in the database or not but don't complain about how it shouldn't have to be leveled.

You claim to not care if the photo makes it into the database or not, but I'm going to have to disagree with you on that. First off, you uploaded it to this site which shows you want it here. Second, it gets rejected for being unlevel and you (like many before you) feel the need to post about it in the forum. Third, when you're told that your photo does have a major flaw, you write an essay on how it doesn't matter and why you don't care if it's in the database or not. You've shown that you actually do care about the photo "making the cut" but like many before you, you react the wrong way when you get a rejection. Rather than accepting that your photo has a major flaw, you get defensive and try to justify the flaw.
Mike B. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2007, 09:05 AM   #24
Serrator
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 57
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike B.
Yes, it does. It's not hard to tell when looking at your photo that it's unlevel. You only need to look at the engine to tell it's leaning. 1.5 degrees is A LOT.
Yes I understand that for you it is easy, but for the vast majority of us mortals it is trivial if it is even noticed. So far the only ones to bring it up are RP folks and I now understand that is a pet peeve here and possibly other train pic galleries, this was my first time posting in one and now I know this. Just for the record I did go in and rotate the image to align the handrails to vertical and it came out to .75 degrees. I believe that is the most reliable part not to mention the longest vertical span giving even more accuracy to this exercise. When your "A LOT" 1.5 is applied I believe the image is actually over rotated. But hey we are here to split pixel hairs.

Quote:
don't complain about how it shouldn't have to be leveled.
Well, I am not sure that I ever complained, but why can't I voice an opinion and or "complain?" I may have a differing view from your narrow gauge or one track mind? (pun intended)


Quote:
You claim to not care if the photo makes it into the database or not, but I'm going to have to disagree with you on that. First off, you uploaded it to this site which shows you want it here.
Ok...disagree.
I was asked to upload my image to this site and until a few days ago knew nothing of it this place. I did not realize it was screened as such, especially after looking at the existing 2 images that exist for this same engine that were uploaded last fall. Once I determined that I had a different view of the engine that "I think" is superior in many ways there would be no problem, since the screeners allowed those. Well I found out that this was not the case.



Quote:
Second, it gets rejected for being unlevel and you (like many before you) feel the need to post about it in the forum.
Incorrect, I posted the pictures to share and never mentioned the rejection cause or my disagreement with the reasoning of the rejection until I was asked.
Here for your reference:
"Since I didn't make the cut I thought I would post this here for anyone interested. It is located in Jackson Missouri and is a tourist dinner ride gig."
If your going to be so technical on .75 - 1.5 degrees please at least be as critical/accurate in your posting. My intention was to provide a simple image for others to enjoy/hate/criticize/nitpick and discuss here in this forum.


Quote:
Third, when you're told that your photo does have a major flaw, you write an essay on how it doesn't matter and why you don't care if it's in the database or not. You've shown that you actually do care about the photo "making the cut" but like many before you, you react the wrong way when you get a rejection. Rather than accepting that your photo has a major flaw, you get defensive and try to justify the flaw.
Now I do not believe I wrote an "essay", but perhaps compared to your normal 3 word criticisms I have seen it would appear that way to you.

Mike, get this into your head...not being in the database is okay by me. I tried and I failed. So what are my options since I don't agree with the screener...hey why not post it in the forum where you can still share the image as well as others that are not allowed in the database for folks to see. I posted the cockpit image that would never be seen in the database as well as my PS fun train OOB. Now is that so wrong? Never did I mention the reason for the rejection until it was directly asked. I gave my thoughts on it from my perspective and that's all there is...I feel that it is a minuscule point that does not add any value or benefit to the image. You say it's a "major flaw", so be it. I am happy with it the way it is, no harm done. Heck use my image as the poster child of a bad example for others to learn from. It has gotten way more attention and comments here than if it had been put in the database, so all is good.

To be honest all this discussion I think has been for nought after reading the submission guidelines that Mr. Ween so kindly provided. My image is an HDR, if you are not familiar with that term it stands for "High Dynamic Range". This consists of taking three differently exposed images and combining them into one for a greater dynamic range of exposures than can be achieved by one exposure. So if I understand the guidelines this falls outside the scope of allowed manipulation. Although I have seen numerous HDR images here in the database I do believe.
Serrator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2007, 09:48 AM   #25
Mike B.
Banned
 
Mike B.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,343
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
Yes I understand that for you it is easy, but for the vast majority of us mortals it is trivial if it is even noticed. So far the only ones to bring it up are RP folks and I now understand that is a pet peeve here and possibly other train pic galleries, this was my first time posting in one and now I know this. Just for the record I did go in and rotate the image to align the handrails to vertical and it came out to .75 degrees. I believe that is the most reliable part not to mention the longest vertical span giving even more accuracy to this exercise. When your "A LOT" 1.5 is applied I believe the image is actually over rotated. But hey we are here to split pixel hairs.
If a "mortal" can't see that your photo is unlevel, that's really bad. You either need to look closer or learn what a level photo looks like. You admitted to not easily knowing that it's unlevel, so I'll trust JRDMC's 1.5 degrees over your .75. Regardless, .75 is still a lot in my opinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
Well, I am not sure that I ever complained, but why can't I voice an opinion and or "complain?" I may have a differing view from your narrow gauge or one track mind? (pun intended)
Your essay sure sounded like complaining to me. Are you saying that I'm narrow minded because I like photos to be technically correct?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
Ok...disagree.
I was asked to upload my image to this site and until a few days ago knew nothing of it this place. I did not realize it was screened as such, especially after looking at the existing 2 images that exist for this same engine that were uploaded last fall. Once I determined that I had a different view of the engine that "I think" is superior in many ways there would be no problem, since the screeners allowed those. Well I found out that this was not the case.
I don't care how "superior" any photo may be, if it's unlevel, it should be rejected. No way around it. It's an easy thing to fix and there is no excuse for not leveling a photo. If that's too much to ask, take your photos elsewhere.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
Incorrect, I posted the pictures to share and never mentioned the rejection cause or my disagreement with the reasoning of the rejection until I was asked.
Here for your reference:
"Since I didn't make the cut I thought I would post this here for anyone interested. It is located in Jackson Missouri and is a tourist dinner ride gig."
If your going to be so technical on .75 - 1.5 degrees please at least be as critical/accurate in your posting. My intention was to provide a simple image for others to enjoy/hate/criticize/nitpick and discuss here in this forum.
Regardless of when you starting talking about the rejection, you have. I don't think timing matters. If you want to get really picky, I never mentioned anything about your first post which you're assuming I'm talking about.

If all you really wanted to do was to share the photo with us, what makes you think we want to even see it? The screeners rejected it and we follow their rules, so...

Seriously, I don't understand people like you who feel like everyone needs to see their photos. Usually people who think everyone wants to see their photos are mistaken.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serrator
Now I do not believe I wrote an "essay", but perhaps compared to your normal 3 word criticisms I have seen it would appear that way to you.

Mike, get this into your head...not being in the database is okay by me. I tried and I failed. So what are my options since I don't agree with the screener...hey why not post it in the forum where you can still share the image as well as others that are not allowed in the database for folks to see. I posted the cockpit image that would never be seen in the database as well as my PS fun train OOB. Now is that so wrong? Never did I mention the reason for the rejection until it was directly asked. I gave my thoughts on it from my perspective and that's all there is...I feel that it is a minuscule point that does not add any value or benefit to the image. You say it's a "major flaw", so be it. I am happy with it the way it is, no harm done. Heck use my image as the poster child of a bad example for others to learn from. It has gotten way more attention and comments here than if it had been put in the database, so all is good.

To be honest all this discussion I think has been for nought after reading the submission guidelines that Mr. Ween so kindly provided. My image is an HDR, if you are not familiar with that term it stands for "High Dynamic Range". This consists of taking three differently exposed images and combining them into one for a greater dynamic range of exposures than can be achieved by one exposure. So if I understand the guidelines this falls outside the scope of allowed manipulation. Although I have seen numerous HDR images here in the database I do believe.
I write 3 letter posts? There is a limit of 10, so technically, that's not even possible.

You mentioned that you don't agree with the screeners. How do you not agree? Do you really think your photo is level? Or have you convinced yourself that an unlevel photo should make it in the database? If you do think that, you are sorely mistaken as any photo, regardless of quality, should be rejected if unlevel. If you don't think a photo being unlevel (especially to the degree yours is) is a major flaw, you'll need to reevaluate your standards if you hope to get on RP in the future.

It looks like your into PS manipulation and as you've discovered, that is frowned upon here. You don't seem to be too concerned about capturing an accurate representation of a scene. If your photos are manipulated, I don't want to see them and they do not belong on this website.

Last edited by Mike B.; 06-17-2007 at 09:53 AM.
Mike B. is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 07:24 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.