Old 07-28-2013, 07:08 PM   #1
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Default LOL foreground clutter........

Only 1 stancion in the way is clutter? LOL. What do you guys think?

http://www.railpictures.net/viewreje...10&key=4893841
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Old 07-28-2013, 07:14 PM   #2
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The screener mentioned only one of several possible complaints. Nasty harsh high sun light, not level, bad cropping (a bit tight and unpleasant cutting off of stuff). Some of the technical issues can be improved but in the end this one just isn't going to fly, I suspect.
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Old 07-28-2013, 08:33 PM   #3
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That's new? Why would they design something to make it look like it was from the 70s? Has the retro trend moved from the auto industry to train designs?
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Old 07-28-2013, 08:45 PM   #4
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That's new? Why would they design something to make it look like it was from the 70s? Has the retro trend moved from the auto industry to train designs?
If it's new, I bet they regret that purchase after that derailment in Spain last week. That thing was a death trap.

But yes, it is very 70's looking.

Oh, and I agree with the foreground clutter rejection. Why didnt you just move the stanchion?
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Old 07-28-2013, 08:58 PM   #5
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As J noted, the photo has other issues had they not mentioned that one, but that one does kill it.

Were this a photo from thirty or forty years ago of something that no longer existed, that thing would not be a problem at all, but with a piece of equipment that is brand new and can be shot tomorrow, it's a an issue.

To Troy's remark about the Spain crash, that train was doing something like twice its speed limit on a curve (which at that speed was insane). Show me any single piece of rail equipment in the world that is not a deathtrap if you do that sort of thing with it.
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Old 07-28-2013, 09:12 PM   #6
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They were being nice only giving you a rejection for that.
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Old 07-28-2013, 09:14 PM   #7
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To Troy's remark about the Spain crash, that train was doing something like twice its speed limit on a curve (which at that speed was insane). Show me any single piece of rail equipment in the world that is not a deathtrap if you do that sort of thing with it.
It would have been ugly, but an amfleet would have survived a lot better. I thought the same thing you did until I read some fairly informative posts on some web forums and yahoo groups about it.

Put it to you like this, I wouldnt want to be in either, and you are absolutely right about not being designed for something like that, but I would rather take my chances in an Amfleet or Acella.
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Old 07-28-2013, 09:49 PM   #8
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There are certainly differences between car design requirements in Europe and the US. So Troy can get away with saying "a lot better", I suppose, but really it is an empty statement unless Troy has some design background and can give us a engineering estimate of how many fewer lives would have lost had the train in Spain met FRA standards.
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Old 07-28-2013, 10:36 PM   #9
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There are certainly differences between car design requirements in Europe and the US. So Troy can get away with saying "a lot better", I suppose, but really it is an empty statement unless Troy has some design background and can give us a engineering estimate of how many fewer lives would have lost had the train in Spain met FRA standards.
Admittedly just like the rest of you I just go by what I read on the web in regards to this, but if some of them are bullshitting, they are doing a pretty good job of it.
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Old 07-28-2013, 10:43 PM   #10
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Bad motive is more like it.

And I doubt even a mother could love it.

I'd have moved the stanchion - through the front window. And then, and only then, taken the shot.

There's nothing 70's looking about this all.

It's all modern day AMERICAN design. They took the Spanish design (streamlined and aesthetic) and trashed it. It's amazing buildings in the US are not all simple rectangles identical to one another.

/Mitch

As for the rejection - either move the obstruction next time, or wait for a coming better opportunity. Might I suggest a going away shot.
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Old 07-29-2013, 12:02 AM   #11
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Admittedly just like the rest of you I just go by what I read on the web in regards to this, but if some of them are bullshitting, they are doing a pretty good job of it.
You miss the point. They are not bullshitting in terms of the direction of the effect, but the magnitude of the effect is at issue. Like most policy decisions, there are tradeoffs. In the US we choose not to take advantage of the world's experience with passenger equipment by enforcing FRA's regulations which prevent non-compliant designs from being purchased off the shelf, at a lower price. In exchange we, presumably, have some greater amount of safety in case of collision/derailment. I don't know what that greater amount is. I feel reasonably confident, as a layperson!, that the amount isn't much if you enter that curve at that speed. But none of us are passenger equipment engineers.
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Old 07-29-2013, 12:09 AM   #12
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I honestly am not an engineer but I don't think I'd want to be in anything (even an Amfleet) that entered a 60MPH curve at 118MPH.

Who knows, maybe that extra steel would actually cause my death to be more drawn out and painful?
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Old 07-29-2013, 01:04 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mgoldman View Post
I'd have moved the stanchion - through the front window. And then, and only then, taken the shot.


Quote:
There's nothing 70's looking about this all.
It's totally 70s looking to me, like some kind of goofy looking snowmobile from that era.

It's not too far off from this:




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Old 07-29-2013, 03:28 AM   #14
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It's totally 70s looking to me, like some kind of goofy looking snowmobile from that era.
Winner!

Not that it matters, but I used to have an old AMF Skidaddler ('73, I believe) that looked a heck of a lot like an F unit.
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Old 07-29-2013, 09:32 PM   #15
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Winner!

Not that it matters, but I used to have an old AMF Skidaddler ('73, I believe) that looked a heck of a lot like an F unit.
We had one too! I rode the heck out of it in the late 70s/early 80s. Thing was a beast...and a pain in the ass to pull start for this young kid due to it being a 2-stroke. I think ours was a '72 and it looked a lot like this:



Our other snowmobile was this:



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Old 07-30-2013, 04:59 AM   #16
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We had one too! I rode the heck out of it in the late 70s/early 80s. Thing was a beast...and a pain in the ass to pull start for this young kid due to it being a 2-stroke. I think ours was a '72 and it looked a lot like this:


That looks a lot newer than mine. Mine must've been from the late '60s then. I think I still have the hood on one of my properties down the road. I should go take a shot of it tomorrow after work.

Here's a link from Google of a '69. This is what mine looked like: http://www.google.ca/url?sa=i&source...75246874661145
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Old 07-31-2013, 02:53 AM   #17
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THIS is foreground clutter
Image © RailfanTerry
PhotoID: 445264
Photograph © RailfanTerry
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Old 07-31-2013, 03:59 AM   #18
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Wasn't there enough space to move slightly right and have the photo avoiding the clutter?

Last edited by lalam; 07-31-2013 at 04:01 AM.
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Old 07-31-2013, 05:14 AM   #19
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but somehow this isn't foreground clutter?

http://www.railpictures.net/photo/445286

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Old 07-31-2013, 05:59 AM   #20
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but somehow this isn't foreground clutter?

http://www.railpictures.net/photo/445286
Nope, its not. The train isn't obstructed like it is in yours.
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Old 07-31-2013, 02:02 PM   #21
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Image © Andrew Robb
PhotoID: 445404
Photograph © Andrew Robb


That frame looks better than your first try, anyway. Well done.
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Old 08-01-2013, 12:22 AM   #22
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Image © Andrew Robb
PhotoID: 445404
Photograph © Andrew Robb


That frame looks better than your first try, anyway. Well done.

Background clutter if you ask me - that thing distracts my eyes from one of the subjects - the perfectly aesthetic stanchion. Can you go back and maybe have them move the train out of the way and reshoot?

As for the other examples of "clutter" - really? That is how you make your point? The Corman police car adds - it's related, color matched and perfectly placed avoiding obstruction of even the lettering on the tender.

David's shot - though I am not always a fan of blurry foregrounds, A) Does not obstruct the train and B) Puts the scene in context. It's no longer just a wedge and is composed to show the viewer the full scene putting priority /emphasis on the main subject. Some may have preferred the opposite in blur in regards to the subject but this is still RAILpictures, lol.

/Mitch
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Old 08-01-2013, 02:01 AM   #23
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Quote:
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but somehow this isn't foreground clutter?

http://www.railpictures.net/photo/445286
On the contrary, adds greatly to the composition.
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Old 08-01-2013, 06:04 AM   #24
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Hey, I thought if I read far enough, there would be more pictures of vintage snow machines - that is what they are called right?
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Old 08-01-2013, 10:53 AM   #25
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Hey, I thought if I read far enough, there would be more pictures of vintage snow machines - that is what they are called right?
For us old guys, yeah.

And this has always been my favorite vintage snow machine.



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